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NPP Only (Bear With Me)
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Nosmarter
Level 1

Join date: Jul 2009
Posts: 64

I've done three cycles, 2x Test+Deca and this last one: 300 test + 400 NPP + TBol (50 mg/d x 6wks). I also used HCG during the cycle and a bit afterwards.

I do love test, but after each cycle, I get a bit of hair loss, and it's really making me want to quit cycling. But before I do, I'm considering a NPP + TBol cycle only. I've read as much as I can on it, but the web seems to be full of the same thing:

Q: Anybody ever do a NPP (or Deca) only cycle?
A: Dude, use some test. Test is best. Otherwise you're gonna be shut down for a year.
Q: Have you ever doen such a cycle?
A: No, but this bro at the gym has a cousin who knows a guy ..

So I get that Nand will shut you down hard. But will it shut you doen any harder if you don't take test? I mean it seems to me that Test + NPP or "NPP only" will shut you down just the same and will require the same level of PCT. Maybe the test will make you feel better sexually during the cycle (muscle building effects aside), but that's it. Where am I wrong here?

Assuming this is right and it takes 6 weeks of PCT to get back to normal (assuming regular HCG use as well) - is there a real downside to going on NPP only?

Has anyone had any first hand experience with this? Thanks in advance.

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Reed
Level

Join date: Jan 2010
Posts: 4432

Maybe ask your self this question and then decide... is having thinner hair easier to live with or having a dick that just wont work. If its easier and a better situation run some test even at a TRT level to be safe. If your ok with with having a full head of hair to be be a bit more attractive but you can't get it up once you have them back at your place what gold did it do. If neither scenario is more or less welcoming don't cycle. If hair loss is stopping you from cycling your not that dedicated to what ever sport your trying to better your self for and if your only cycling to look good then that's attainable with out the gear.

How ever I could be biased as I have been going bald since freshman year of high-school and have been shaving my head since then so I could give 2 fucks about my hair :-)

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Nosmarter
Level 1

Join date: Jul 2009
Posts: 64

Ok, fair enough. But having "a dick that just won't work" is potentially a problem only during the cycle, right? Isn't post cycle NPP and post cycle NPP+Test the same thing? Or are you suugesting that using test during cycle will make the PCT easier?

Reed wrote:
Maybe ask your self this question and then decide... is having thinner hair easier to live with or having a dick that just wont work. If its easier and a better situation run some test even at a TRT level to be safe. If your ok with with having a full head of hair to be be a bit more attractive but you can't get it up once you have them back at your place what gold did it do. If neither scenario is more or less welcoming don't cycle. If hair loss is stopping you from cycling your not that dedicated to what ever sport your trying to better your self for and if your only cycling to look good then that's attainable with out the gear.

How ever I could be biased as I have been going bald since freshman year of high-school and have been shaving my head since then so I could give 2 fucks about my hair :-)

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incredulous
Level

Join date: Nov 2012
Posts: 168

It shouldn't shut you down harder running no test. However, If you don't use any test then you will have no test in your system except a small amount from the tbol and any that is produced by your testes in response to the hcg. There's no reason not to run at least a replacement dose. Any sexual dysfunction would probably be transient but why risk it?

That having been said, why do you think it's the test? Have you ever run test only? Nandrolone is not benign.

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Nosmarter
Level 1

Join date: Jul 2009
Posts: 64

Well on the basis of most of what I've read I gathered the following:

1) Hair loss is caused in part by test->dht conversion. The extra dht then aggravates MPB if you're prone to it. So extra test = extra dht = faster hair loss

2) Nandrolone doesn't convert to dht. Instead it converts to dhn which has little if any effect on the hair follicles. I've even read some suggestions that the dhn prevents dht from attaching to receptors in the scalp because it competes with it.

But that said, I'm ready to hear anything else you have on the subject.


incredulous wrote:
It shouldn't shut you down harder running no test. However, If you don't use any test then you will have no test in your system except a small amount from the tbol and any that is produced by your testes in response to the hcg. There's no reason not to run at least a replacement dose. Any sexual dysfunction would probably be transient but why risk it?

That having been said, why do you think it's the test? Have you ever run test only? Nandrolone is not benign.

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rds63799
Level

Join date: Nov 2011
Posts: 3730

run at least a replacement dose of test. It'll keep your dick working.

get a dopamine agonist too

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niksamaras
Level

Join date: Nov 2010
Posts: 1767

I really don't understand those guys who care about thei hair. What are you, a chick? If you start going bald, shave that shit altogether. Easy as that.

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PAINTRAINDave
Level

Join date: Jan 2010
Posts: 814

Winstrol (A powerful DHT derivative) is often sold as Turinabol. That may have affected your rate of hairloss during your last cycle.

Just something to consider.

Cheers,
-PTD

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Nosmarter
Level 1

Join date: Jul 2009
Posts: 64

I just thought I'd give you guys a belated update on the results of this cycle. I actually did 160 NPP eod and 50 Prop eod which I later bumped up to 60. I also took .25 adex daily.

I can't say this was a great cycle as compared to previous ones and I think the overriding factor was the higher NPP led to some sides that were annoying. For one, I couldn't, for the life of me, get rid of the excess water I was holding. It would vary, but at times, I looked like I had a pot-belly from so much water. Although I got bigger on cycle, the bloat made me all nice and smooth.

On the plus side, I gained alot of strength. My benched jumped by 40 lbs as did my squat. I was afraid that post-cycle I might lose it all, but actually my numbers only went down by 10 lbs on each more or less - so I kept a 30 lbs net gain in strength. Another plus is that I lost no hair, which was the primary reason I chose this route. But here I am almost a year later, and it took me 10 months for my libido to recover.

I've had great expériences with NPP in the past, but only when I kept the amounts to 200-300 mg per week and no more. So I doubt I'll do this again. So far, one of my best cycles was 300 Supertest, 200 NPP, and 50 mg t-bol. My next cycle I'm going to try 400 Test, 60 mg t-bol and no NPP to see what happens.

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ESX
Level

Join date: Mar 2012
Posts: 233

You can run some finesteride on cycle which will help you keep your hair. Will probably also mess libido up a bit, but not as bad as NPP only. Personally I'd just get the clippers out and not worry about it. As has been said is rather smash the mrs with no hair than look like Fabio but have to thumb in a semi.

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c.m.l.
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Join date: Dec 2012
Posts: 603

Dont take finasteride, it is bad stuff

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Nosmarter
Level 1

Join date: Jul 2009
Posts: 64

I have to agree. Finasteride scares the shit out of me. I realize there are people out there that have gotten no sides at all after years of use - but it's such a high stakes gamble if you lose.

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CATMAL
Level

Join date: Jul 2013
Posts: 25

The cycles that you've run in the past are very low, Test wise. What you've got to remember is what folks on here and other boards echo all the time, the same substances and quantities (sides too) work differently on each individual. Dosages are kind of guidlines. It takes literally years to find what amounts and compounds work best for YOU. Maybe 300/week Test has had some positive effect for you, but 500/week is more or less the standard and a good base to build from. Remember, if you are serious about this "lifestyle" (and you fucking better be otherwise don't even bother) you should put in the time, effort, and educate yourself to the pro's and con's. All of them! Marathon not a race, right?!

As far as the hair loss issue, once again, different for everybody. Most guys have certain predispositions. Basically, you were gonna lose your hair anyway, this just accelerated the process. Some guys get bad Gyno, acne/bacne , etc. There are so many factors that come into play it can mindfuck the shit out of you. That's why relying on standards can be such a great tool for beginners, i.e. folks that have run gear for 3-5 years or less. On these boards we see so many guys with little to no knowledge of what they are doing/want to do, posting stupid shit and getting smacked down for posting it. I see mainly two problems, 1) Lack of homework (laziness)/bunk info/Broscience, and 2) Trying to run complicated cycles when beginner/KISS standard protocol shit works best.

I'd put you questions into cat 2, more complicated than it needs to be. I'm not trying to sound like a dick but this is the advise I'd give you as well as any other member, 10-12 week Test E @ 500/wk with a standard PCT/recovery period after. There's a reason this is a standard cycle, it works. Maybe a DBol kicker in the first 4 weeks @ 30-40/day but it really doesn't need to be much more complicated than that. Save the Deca/EQ/Tren for later cycles. See how your body reacts to simpler cycles. HcG, I guess that's up to you. I personally have run Test/DBol cycles with standard PCT since 2006, never going over 500/wk. Other than taking a total break for a year and a half starting in winter of 2010 (lonf divorce process) this worked for me as far as meeting my goals. I now blast and cruise, not ever PCT'ing or coming off.

Give it a try, at least some thought anyway.

On a side note, Reed the legs are looking fucking dangerous in the new pic!

S/F

Al

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jaast
Level

Join date: Oct 2014
Posts: 1

Nosmarter wrote:
I just thought I'd give you guys a belated update on the results of this cycle. I actually did 160 NPP eod and 50 Prop eod which I later bumped up to 60. I also took .25 adex daily.

I can't say this was a great cycle as compared to previous ones and I think the overriding factor was the higher NPP led to some sides that were annoying. For one, I couldn't, for the life of me, get rid of the excess water I was holding. It would vary, but at times, I looked like I had a pot-belly from so much water. Although I got bigger on cycle, the bloat made me all nice and smooth.

On the plus side, I gained alot of strength. My benched jumped by 40 lbs as did my squat. I was afraid that post-cycle I might lose it all, but actually my numbers only went down by 10 lbs on each more or less - so I kept a 30 lbs net gain in strength. Another plus is that I lost no hair, which was the primary reason I chose this route. But here I am almost a year later, and it took me 10 months for my libido to recover.

I've had great expériences with NPP in the past, but only when I kept the amounts to 200-300 mg per week and no more. So I doubt I'll do this again. So far, one of my best cycles was 300 Supertest, 200 NPP, and 50 mg t-bol. My next cycle I'm going to try 400 Test, 60 mg t-bol and no NPP to see what happens.




Did you have libido issues during cycle also? Also did you use hcg as you said you were going to on cycle? If so how much hcg did you use a week? I would find it surprising if you used hcg on cycle and then had a difficult PCT.

Has anyone else done a no-test cycle with hcg? How was your libido on cycle? and how was your PCT? Very curious!

I appreciate any info.

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Nosmarter
Level 1

Join date: Jul 2009
Posts: 64

My cycle is hardly complicated .. but not sure that adding dbol to a cycle is a good idea for someone trying to avoid bloat and hairloss. But then again, I've only done 5 cycles . Between, I did do 450 test a week on a cycle. It was great, but not that much better than 300.


CATMAL wrote:
The cycles that you've run in the past are very low, Test wise. What you've got to remember is what folks on here and other boards echo all the time, the same substances and quantities (sides too) work differently on each individual. Dosages are kind of guidlines. It takes literally years to find what amounts and compounds work best for YOU. Maybe 300/week Test has had some positive effect for you, but 500/week is more or less the standard and a good base to build from. Remember, if you are serious about this "lifestyle" (and you fucking better be otherwise don't even bother) you should put in the time, effort, and educate yourself to the pro's and con's. All of them! Marathon not a race, right?!

As far as the hair loss issue, once again, different for everybody. Most guys have certain predispositions. Basically, you were gonna lose your hair anyway, this just accelerated the process. Some guys get bad Gyno, acne/bacne , etc. There are so many factors that come into play it can mindfuck the shit out of you. That's why relying on standards can be such a great tool for beginners, i.e. folks that have run gear for 3-5 years or less. On these boards we see so many guys with little to no knowledge of what they are doing/want to do, posting stupid shit and getting smacked down for posting it. I see mainly two problems, 1) Lack of homework (laziness)/bunk info/Broscience, and 2) Trying to run complicated cycles when beginner/KISS standard protocol shit works best.

I'd put you questions into cat 2, more complicated than it needs to be. I'm not trying to sound like a dick but this is the advise I'd give you as well as any other member, 10-12 week Test E @ 500/wk with a standard PCT/recovery period after. There's a reason this is a standard cycle, it works. Maybe a DBol kicker in the first 4 weeks @ 30-40/day but it really doesn't need to be much more complicated than that. Save the Deca/EQ/Tren for later cycles. See how your body reacts to simpler cycles. HcG, I guess that's up to you. I personally have run Test/DBol cycles with standard PCT since 2006, never going over 500/wk. Other than taking a total break for a year and a half starting in winter of 2010 (lonf divorce process) this worked for me as far as meeting my goals. I now blast and cruise, not ever PCT'ing or coming off.

Give it a try, at least some thought anyway.

On a side note, Reed the legs are looking fucking dangerous in the new pic!

S/F

Al

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Nosmarter
Level 1

Join date: Jul 2009
Posts: 64

jaast wrote:
Did you have libido issues during cycle also? Also did you use hcg as you said you were going to on cycle? If so how much hcg did you use a week? I would find it surprising if you used hcg on cycle and then had a difficult PCT.

Has anyone else done a no-test cycle with hcg? How was your libido on cycle? and how was your PCT? Very curious!

I appreciate any info.


No libido issues on cycle - but no real big spike in libido either. I wound up not using HCG until the end of my cycle because there was a sudden shortage of bac water everywhere. My PCT was nolva for 6 weeks. I thought I was recovered OK, but my libido took awhile.

In any case, I just turned 50, so I'm blasting and crusing from here on out. Right now, I take 100 mg test a week until my next blast.

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