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'How to Train' Questions
 

Roundhead
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Join date: Apr 2008
Posts: 355

Hadn't checked back in for replies in a while, thanks for those. I agree it is pretty much essential.

duffyj2 wrote:

Sparring then pads then shadow + bag. Such is the order of importance. There's no reason you can't learn to box effectively (If not optimally) without a bag. Then again, I have literally no idea how you managed to find a boxing gym without a heavy bag. Do they even exist?


It wasn't a boxing gym, it was a sanda club. And I dismissed it for not having a heavy bag (or any bag). Just making sure I was confident in my decision.

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ugaMMA411
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Join date: Dec 2011
Posts: 70

Honestly, if anyone is looking for a good strength and conditioning program for MMA/BJJ/Combat sports, the best thing to do is to look up the top S&C, such as Martin Rooney, Joel Jaimeson, Jim "Smitty" Smith (just to name a few), and see what they do with their athletes.
Honestly, in the 4+ years I've been training (which isn't much) I've realized that different things work for different people. There are underlying fundamentals (periodization, alactic threshold training, aerobic training, etc), but what works for me may not necessarily work for you. I'm a bantamweight, and I know that what works for me in regards to diet, strength and conditioning, is not what would work for a heavyweight. Forums are an easy way to get false info from people that think they know everything. Instead, look at what the best trainers in the world are doing, and you will be miles ahead of others in the game.

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WyldFlower
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Join date: Jun 2007
Posts: 495

Yeah there are dedicated forums for this stuff peopled by ACTUAL top level coaches... i wouldn't bother posting anything in this thread.

Joel Jamieson's 8weekout is a good place to seek out programmes he himself recommends/has taylored and get feedback on your own programmes by people who implement HIS plans.

Sure there are others. I wouldn't post anything here.

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Roundhead
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Join date: Apr 2008
Posts: 355

WyldFlower wrote:
I wouldn't post anything here.


I like irony.

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WyldFlower
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Join date: Jun 2007
Posts: 495

Way to take my quote out of context, fool. I was clearly talking about not posting anything regarding my training programme here... i've had lots of useless advice from lots of internet forums regarding "programmin" over my last five-and-a-half-years doing combat sports...

ESPECIALLY if you're a beginner.

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Roundhead
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Join date: Apr 2008
Posts: 355

WyldFlower wrote:
Way to take my quote out of context, fool.


Steady on chap, it's just a joke. You'll be ok.

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WyldFlower
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Join date: Jun 2007
Posts: 495

Awwww, don't be sensitive! I didn't mean "fool" in a nasty way, i meant it in a jovial pally way :D

Otherwise i would have called you a cunt, i'm prone to do that.

Don't be so sensitive Roundhead!! Not everyone's out to get you!!! :P

xxxx

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Schwarzfahrer
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Join date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3520

I'd take a heavybag over pads any day.
Others need pads and cannot string one useful combination + movement together without it.

We all agree: Sparring is no#1

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FightinIrish26
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Join date: Feb 2005
Posts: 17008

Schwarzfahrer wrote:
I'd take a heavybag over pads any day.
Others need pads and cannot string one useful combination + movement together without it.

We all agree: Sparring is no#1


I don't. Shadowboxing is the #1 learning tool. No doubt.

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Schwarzfahrer
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Join date: Jun 2005
Posts: 3520

I could act sly and let my virtual fighter, who knows only sparring, crush your virtual fighter, who's sole training consists of shadowboxing ;)
No, I get what you're saying.

I was thinking more along the lines of stuff you can do with equipment and partners.
Shadowboxing is a must, of course. No question.

Over the years I observed that the truly dedicated automatically shadowbox more and without being told so, sometimes even without being particularly aware of it.
The not so dedicated on the other hand cannot grasp it's value.

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prestonjwes
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Join date: Apr 2012
Posts: 8

Hello all I am new to the forums a d in light of all the brilliant posts I would like to get some feedback on my strength training program.
Im pretty serious about my bjj training now I would love to be a world class bjj practitioner and I understand that 90% of that is technical skill but I would love to have some great strength and athleticism to go along with it.

I currently train bjj about 2 hours a day about 5 days a week ,so I think to keep from over training I should commit to 2 weekly strength training sessions about 30 to 45 minuets apiece.

And that's where I'm getting stuck... I'm caught between focusing on strength and power or muscular endurance. I believe Xena and some other posters stated that we get most of our muscular endurance training from our sport itself, so would that mean it would be better tof focus on strength and power in our supplemental strength training?

I'm pretty accustomed bodyweight exercises due to my background in striking martial arts where our coaches were very adamant about not letting us lift but I do love lifting weights and as a physical therapy and kineseology student I understand their importance in GPP.

Any feedback you guys can offer is welcome and thanks in advance.

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FightinIrish26
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Join date: Feb 2005
Posts: 17008

prestonjwes wrote:
Hello all I am new to the forums a d in light of all the brilliant posts I would like to get some feedback on my strength training program.
Im pretty serious about my bjj training now I would love to be a world class bjj practitioner and I understand that 90% of that is technical skill but I would love to have some great strength and athleticism to go along with it.

I currently train bjj about 2 hours a day about 5 days a week ,so I think to keep from over training I should commit to 2 weekly strength training sessions about 30 to 45 minuets apiece.

And that's where I'm getting stuck... I'm caught between focusing on strength and power or muscular endurance. I believe Xena and some other posters stated that we get most of our muscular endurance training from our sport itself, so would that mean it would be better tof focus on strength and power in our supplemental strength training?

I'm pretty accustomed bodyweight exercises due to my background in striking martial arts where our coaches were very adamant about not letting us lift but I do love lifting weights and as a physical therapy and kineseology student I understand their importance in GPP.

Any feedback you guys can offer is welcome and thanks in advance.


I share the opinion of Jim Wendler on this matter - he said that as long as there's "MMA strength coaches" making their athletes do circuits as their lifting work, he'll always have a job. And he's right.

Your time in the weightroom is very, very limited, therefore, in my opinion, you should be striving to get as strong as you possibly can within that time, especially if you're a grappler, and that maximal strength can really help you out within the context of your sport.

My suggestion - and it has worked very well for me - is to pick up Wendler's 5/3/1 book, and go with the twice a week plan that gives you plenty of time to both work your skills and recover. It also happens to be probably the most adaptable program I've ever used, so if you find yourself suffering as far as mat work because of your lifting, you can easily readjust the volume while still making progress on your main lifts.

I really can't recommend this program high enough, it truly has changed the way I look at training. And if you're training for fighting, it's just the best damn program there is.

My opinion, anyway.


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therickuss
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Join date: Apr 2012
Posts: 55

I havnt read all this but i didnt see anything about stabilization training, as far as i know thats a must for any sport. all trainers ive seen under emphasize the stabilzation training because they stop when they think the connective are somewhat strengthened, but the elasicity or potential energy can be unleached in a shorter duration if the tendons and legaments are more dense therefore transmit energy better and that equals increased power. Do you follow me?

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FightinIrish26
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Join date: Feb 2005
Posts: 17008

therickuss wrote:
I havnt read all this but i didnt see anything about stabilization training, as far as i know thats a must for any sport. all trainers ive seen under emphasize the stabilzation training because they stop when they think the connective are somewhat strengthened, but the elasicity or potential energy can be unleached in a shorter duration if the tendons and legaments are more dense therefore transmit energy better and that equals increased power. Do you follow me?


Yea, you're trying to sell power plates. Scram.

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Spartiates
Level 5

Join date: May 2009
Posts: 1634

FightinIrish26 wrote:
therickuss wrote:
I havnt read all this but i didnt see anything about stabilization training, as far as i know thats a must for any sport. all trainers ive seen under emphasize the stabilzation training because they stop when they think the connective are somewhat strengthened, but the elasicity or potential energy can be unleached in a shorter duration if the tendons and legaments are more dense therefore transmit energy better and that equals increased power. Do you follow me?


Yea, you're trying to sell power plates. Scram.


Lol

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therickuss
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Join date: Apr 2012
Posts: 55

no really, power plates are a total scam, i was saying there isnt anything on here about that
about connective tissue stimulation. an underrated subject that newbs just dont talk about.

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therickuss
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Join date: Apr 2012
Posts: 55

thats the reason athletic trainers deem explosive training so dangerous. they stop stability training before they get the proper strength or tension built on the connective tissue. if you think about it you will see what im talking about.

If you can stabilize any given movement pattern with more weight/resistance/tension than the other guy, you would have the advantage to strengthen that area and so on(without screwing up your technique. But if you cant stabilize then the movement pattern gets distorted in your neuro pathways and you are screwing up your technique. does that make sense?

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legendaryblaze
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Join date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1431

No one cares, the-ri-dick-u-luss. And athletic trainers deem explosive training great.


I think my training plan is good, but I want some confirmation/criticism.

Added it as an image to help visualize. To see the full size, drag the image to your browser search bar.
Both Wrestling and Judo are 2 hours long, per session.
Hill sprint is about 2km.
Rock climbing is about an hour - an hour 30.
Weight vest is 45 lbs.


Monday:

Morning:
Front squats 5/3/1
Weighted pull ups - 7 reps, 3 sets
Weighted front lever followed by weighted leg raises - 7 reps, 3 sets


Week 1 and 3: Judo in afternoon
Week 2 and 4: Wrestling in afternoon

Wednesday:
Over Head Press 5/3/1
Dips - 7 reps, 3 sets
Weighted chin ups - 7 reps, 3 sets
Weighted leg raises - max reps, 1 set

Week 1, 2 and 3: Wrestling
Week 4: Judo

Thursday:
week 1, 2 and 3: Judo

Friday:
Deadlift 5/3/1
BBell Rows - 7 reps, 3 sets
Weighted Planks - 30 seconds, 3 sets
Weighted Valslide chest slides - max reps, 1 set

Week 1 and 3: Indoor rock climbing
Week 2: Weighted indoor rock climbing (weight vest)

Saturday:
Week 1 and 3: Weighted hill sprints (weight vest)
Week 2: Hill sprints
Week 4: Light jog


Week 4 is a deload week.

Reason for rock climbing is that I enjoy rock climbing + builds grip and back strength.

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FightinIrish26
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Join date: Feb 2005
Posts: 17008

I like that schedule blaze. I was never good at two-a-days, mostly because I'm not good at working out in the morning and I find myself drained after one session - but if you can do it, and you're good with it, go for it.

I also like that you have two days totally off. Good idea. Doing two tough sessions a day will take a lot out of you, and taking two days where you're not doing shit is a very good idea.

I might go even a little lighter on my deload week if I was you, though - maybe two gym sessions, not three...but that's optional. I could see three sessions working alright also.

Good plan though. Good overall volume, and I like that you're not killing yourself with lifting either.

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legendaryblaze
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Join date: Jun 2009
Posts: 1431

Posters like you, Xen Nova, and co, have, over the years, constantly beat in to my head that lifting is nothing more than GPP. People like Mark Rippetoe, Jim Wendler, etc, have said the same.
Also, from my own personal experience, I've come to the same conclusion.

I think I will make my deload week lighter. I wasn't sure about that, actually, and you've reinforced my concern. Thanks for the feedback.

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dutch09
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Join date: May 2009
Posts: 75

So I did not see this question in the last 11 pages and can not find it thru the search engine ... but did find some interesting unrelated sh*t...
so here's the question...
I am looking for a basic conditioning program for a late 40s early fifties (not sure which he is) male who wants to stay up with his teenage kid that is interested in mma ... can anyone id links? or books? or youtube? that I can pass along?

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XanderBuilt
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Join date: Sep 2007
Posts: 2199

I started at an MMA gym in August, prior to that I focused heavily on BB and PL pursuits. When I mean "pursuits" I mean it was more than a hobby and gave me great enjoyment designing programs, meals, supplements etc. Hence my activity on this site. From about April I lost interest quite suddenly and I'm embracing MMA to spark passion again. My main goals are getting down to 85kg from 105kg, control my blood sugar (type 2 D) and get proficient at combat (my focus will be muay thai first but the gym i joined also does BJJ and I'm very keen but it also looks very tough).

Interested to know advice on:
1. Low carb diets and how they work with MMA sports like MT, Boxing and BJJ.
2. My training plan was to try to train 3 to 5 times a week and weight training wise i would focus on back work (rows, pull ups, deadlifts), legs (single leg and hip flexor work) and shoulder strengthening work (rotator cuff, mobility etc). With this sort of set-up (and based on work capacity, sleep, nutrition, rest etc) would 3-5 times MMA (MT or BJJ) and 3 times weights (from the above selection) be realistic? What am i neglecting? How heavy (% of max wise) would you advise on the the DL?). Thanks.

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Sublime
Level 1

Join date: Sep 2012
Posts: 4

dutch09 wrote:
So I did not see this question in the last 11 pages and can not find it thru the search engine ... but did find some interesting unrelated sh*t...
so here's the question...
I am looking for a basic conditioning program for a late 40s early fifties (not sure which he is) male who wants to stay up with his teenage kid that is interested in mma ... can anyone id links? or books? or youtube? that I can pass along?


I've found BW circuits and running to be the best all around conditioner for me! Check out Infinite Intensity from Ross Enamait

Great info here and since I don't fight I'm going to experiment with ME full body lifts and conditioning at the same time?

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