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Training Schedule for Joints
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astropanic
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 11

Hi All, I'm new here.

There are plenty articles with strategies for building big muscles, and that's great.

My question is, how often I should train my joints ? Especially my wrists, elbows and shoulders make me problems.

I am a 30 years old guy, sitting the whole day on a desk, looking at a computer screen, thats my job.

I have a pull up bar at home, after a warmup, I'm trying hang on the bar, a few times at least for 20 seconds, to strengthen my grip.

I also do dumbbell wrist rolls, hand up, and down variation, and different wrist stretching exercises.

I can do over 40 pushups with good form, but I have pain in the wrists when they are bend at the floor while I'm doing my pushups.

When I take pillows on the floor and make pushups on my fists, I would make easily another set, but after about next 20 pushups, I must give up due to pain in my shoulders.

I was never injured in the wrists, elbows and shoulders in any way, I'm just sitting to long on my butt without exercise (due to my job).

I'm trying to do sports, I'm running at least 2 times a week 5km, and I do at least 3 times a week sculling on real water, occasionally I play badminton.

I don't want be a professional bodybuilder, but how I can make my joints stronger ? It will be ok when I have my grip strong enough to do pull ups with proper form, and pushups without the pain in my joints.

Any ideas ?

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iVoodoo
Level 5

Join date: Mar 2011
Posts: 429

Sounds like you're doing fine considering your goals.
Just keep it consistent and try adding reps progressively.

Push-ups, pull-ups and general exercise is more than sufficient for normal people trying to be healthy.
I'd say add some overhead squats daily and you'd be golden.

Also, there's nothing wrong with push-ups off the fist.

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alexus
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Join date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4751

sort out your work habits.

you need an adjustable work station so you can raise it up to work standing, and lower it so you can squat in front of your desk. ideally work on a laptop so you can work on the floor. that will get you moving around in different positions. there is some stuff out there on seated postures... or check out some of the sitting positions utilized in martial arts... doing computer work from that position will get you moving around regularly so you don't get locked up in traditional computer posture.

do your soft tissue work. foam rolling etc. or get a massage. cramped muscles can result in joint pain (which seems odd, i know, but it can happen).

be aware that tendons take longer to adapt than muscles. i do have periods in my training (e.g.., especially starting up squats after a period without) where my tendons (and their crankiness) simply is the limiting factor. do your soft tissue work and things will sort out...

what is doing that many push-ups gonna do? lower your reps and increase your weight.
why can't you do a pull-up? i'm a girl and i can do a pull-up ffs.

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Gambit_Lost
Level 3

Join date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3949

Foam rolling (and stretching.). My 2cents

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alexus
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Join date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4751

sorry about my post - it was a bit dickish.

i've been reading coach sommer's book in building the gymnastic body and he talks about wrist pain. have you heard of the 'perfect push-up' things? they are meant to help with wrist pain - some people swear by them. those things... parallets? that are like parallel bars but on the floor.. i'm not sure what it is about them... maybe it is being able to hold the wrists straight instead of on a 90 degree angle... i wonder if holding onto dumbbells would have the same effect??

with chin-ups / pull-ups... some people have problems with pronated or supponated grip. it is meant to be friendlier on the joints to have a grip with your palms facing medially in toward each other. some gyms have a gripper thing you can hang over the pull up bar for that. or a more parralel bar set-up for pull ups.

maybe that is the issue? you need that grip orientation?

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alexus
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Join date: Feb 2010
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hopefully someone else can chime in with *why* that grip orientation is friendlier on the joints... and whether there is anything one can do to increase the range of comfortable grip orientations. if that is in fact the problem.

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nighthawkz
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Join date: Aug 2012
Posts: 1242

alexus wrote:
hopefully someone else can chime in with *why* that grip orientation is friendlier on the joints... and whether there is anything one can do to increase the range of comfortable grip orientations. if that is in fact the problem.


A parallel grip, even more so a grip that lets you rotate your wrist (like rings) does not force your joints into an end range of motion; if you put your hands straight in front of you, palms inside will feel more comfortable than up or down. Basic anatomy.

This is why I strongly encourage people who like doing calisthenics at home in installing a pair of rings; they make everything better, at least for the upper body.

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doublelung84
Level 1

Join date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1049

Personally, I think strong, well balanced muscles will go a long way to helping your joints.

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astropanic
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 11

alexus wrote:

why can't you do a pull-up? i'm a girl and i can do a pull-up ffs.


Because one year ago I cut my right index finger, cutting trough my tendon. I'm gradually regenerating my finger, but for now I'm little limited in pulling activity with my right hand.

I don't get it, how I will get lost my wrists pain from sitting in a martial arts position ? Did you mean seiza ?

Maybe I wrote my question not clear enough, sorry. How often I should hang from my pull up bar to strengthen my joints ? Is daily ok, or how long should I make breaks to let the joints rest ?

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astropanic
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 11

Gambit_Lost wrote:
Foam rolling (and stretching.). My 2cents


I'm using sometimes a foam roller for my back, but never tought about using it on my forearms, perfect idea, and a nice experience :) THX

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astropanic
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 11

@doublelung84, did you mean, when I train more my forearms my wristpain will go away ?

@nighthawkz, I tought about rings, but the limiting factor is the poor ceiling in my flat.

German appartment standards doesn't compare in any way the standards of they cars...

I was afraid of mounting the pull up bar, but fortunatelly I managed to mount it between two walls in a floor. I will mount another bar higher, and on that bar I will hang up the rings. THX for the idea.

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alexus
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Join date: Feb 2010
Posts: 4751

the idea with the seated postures was to provide variations from the common seated posture that people get locked in.

it isn't entirely comfortable to work on the floor. that means you need to change up your posture a lot. that means you aren't spending a great deal of time in any one of them. that means you are less likely to develop problems that come from being stuck in one posture.

why do you think that hanging from a pull up bar should help with your wrists?

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astropanic
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 11

I hang from the bar to strength my grip (due to my injury), not to help my wrists. For training my wrists, I make the exercises I described above.

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astropanic
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 11

I hang from the bar to strength my grip (due to my injury), not to help my wrists. For training my wrists, I make the exercises I described above.

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doublelung84
Level 1

Join date: Mar 2012
Posts: 1049

astropanic wrote:
@doublelung84, did you mean, when I train more my forearms my wristpain will go away ?



Wrist pain is a bit of a different animal. Do you use wrist wraps? It's a must when squatting. The stress that is put on the wrist while squatting is sick.

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Trevshenko
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 141

Sadly hanging from your pull-up bar (and pull-ups) is likely the main cause of your joint pain. Your pain is not from joints being "weak" its from frequently forcing them in to less than optimal or "un-natural" positions. I remember having a long chat with a physio i know after my cousin joined the OTC (officer training core) and we were talking about the seemingly endless amount of pull-ups and push-ups he had to do.

When you do a pull-up starting in an over-hand grip as you pull yourself to the bar your arms and shoulder will naturally want to rotate (for want of a better word) which involve your hands turning in towards you so you end up in a parallel (palms facing each other) grip. By holding on a bar and not letting this happen it forces your shoulder joint and its various tendons (i cant remember the specifics im sorry) in to a really unfavourable position. So basically if youre going to do alot of pull-ups BUY SOME GYMNASTIC RINGS or at the very least use a parallel grip. Rings also have the benefit of providing core activation due to their unstable nature.

When it comes to push-ups it could be you have very poor wrist flexibility (which is likely if you sit on a computer all day) and the wrist placement for push-ups is essentially forcing them past their limit. Do wrists stretches several times a day and see if it helps. If that doesnt help then get a pair of perfect push-up thingys and youll be golden i imagine.

Just my 2 cents. Hope thats helpful :)

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Gambit_Lost
Level 3

Join date: Jul 2006
Posts: 3949

astropanic wrote:
Gambit_Lost wrote:
Foam rolling (and stretching.). My 2cents


I'm using sometimes a foam roller for my back, but never tought about using it on my forearms, perfect idea, and a nice experience :) THX


Forearms, lats, hammies, calves, pecs, quads, rear, everywhere is good. Lots of info if you look.

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astropanic
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Join date: Aug 2013
Posts: 11

Thank you all for your ideas.

To clearify things, I have wrist pain only when pushing, when my hand is bend at about 90 degrees, not during pulling.

I had always the pain in my wrists, long before I began with pulling the bar.

I think @Trevshenko is right, it is due to my wrist (un)flexibility.

I will try stretch more my wrists, use rings instead of a bar and do foam rolling.

I will report what the result was.

And to answer to the "perfect pushups thing" I never liked such gymnastic gadgets, but I understand the idea. I will get two of those things from the attached image for a few bucks in a hardware store.



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