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Was the Cop Right?
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illadelphia91
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Join date: Apr 2011
Posts: 394

http://www.worldstarhiphop.com/...1i2TT57Q5J66Edc

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illadelphia91
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Join date: Apr 2011
Posts: 394



Found it on youtube

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illadelphia91
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Join date: Apr 2011
Posts: 394

He's a parolee and apparently he had a throwing knife visible in his hands.

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Rollsroyce13
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Join date: Oct 2009
Posts: 101

Surely they could have used a taser instead of the 10 or so bullets they put in him.

That's rather messed up then putting the handcuffs on him once his basically dead.

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illadelphia91
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Join date: Apr 2011
Posts: 394

The description on Worldstar says this just happened, but i think it actually happened in Summer of 2011. Sorry if it was already posted before!

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illadelphia91
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Join date: Apr 2011
Posts: 394

THe officer also shouts drop the knife before shooting him.

Shooting tens shots was totally unnecessary though.

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strungoutboy21
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Join date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3172

If the guy had a weapon then the cop is justified in shooting him. I don't see a problem with how many shots he fired. You never know how you would react unless you are actually there with the adrenaline pumping through your veins.

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MattyXL
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Join date: Jun 2008
Posts: 9337

Uh oh these threads usually end up bad

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Ct. Rockula
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Join date: Oct 2008
Posts: 17144

Dude had a knife. Dont police have some hand to hand combat skills? Fuck

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SexMachine
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Join date: Mar 2011
Posts: 7328

illadelphia91 wrote:
THe officer also shouts drop the knife before shooting him.

Shooting tens shots was totally unnecessary though.


They're trained to fire multiple shots. It's standard procedure.

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Antonio. B
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Join date: Oct 2011
Posts: 82

At the moment these things with civilian people, at such a big scale, could only happen in one country in the world... It just looks awful and unbelievable - the guy is in his backyard, his mom parks a car, the guy gets out of the car... obviously, as most people in his case he wants to run into his house to hide from police, his wife and children are waiting for the husband in the house... but the husband gets ten bullets in his body... I am surprised the cop didn't shoot the man's wife, although as you see in the video he considered about it for a second... had it been in the dark and not in people's own backyard the wife would have been shot as well.

The man behaved suspiciously, we all do, especially in those stressful situations... but it was miles away from any threatening behavior, and if it looked threatening then a cop should have hidden behind his car and kept giving commands until he becomes sure about the situation and man's intentions... You can punch someone in the face and then say sorry, you can use electro shock and then say sorry... but here a lethal weapon is being used, now you cannot wake the husband and father up... The only justification for this murder would be if the man have just killed someone in front of police and still has a gun in his hands.

The states's law should control cops' behavior.... it's hard to blame the cop, he is just human being and reacts according to the training he has been given, and police practices used in the country, the cop knows, he will not get sentenced for killing when he is on his duty, and for him is much better to kill earlier than to wait and might possibly face a dangerous threat later.

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MartyMonster
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illadelphia91 wrote:
THe officer also shouts drop the knife before shooting him.

Shooting tens shots was totally unnecessary though.


How many is adequate, at what point is it excessive?

Seriously, it's only unnecessary if he pauses to reload.

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batman730
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Ct. Rockula wrote:
Dude had a knife. Dont police have some hand to hand combat skills? Fuck


If the dude has a knife, it's not hand to hand is it?

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harrypotter
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Thecop obviously knew the guy by shouting "ernie" twice.

However the guy was all hyped up and scrambling around by the car, people should know by now that doing that with American cops leads to a lot of bullets coming your way.

Also, his kids will grow up hating cops and will likely kill a one or two. The vicious cycle continues.

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Ct. Rockula
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Join date: Oct 2008
Posts: 17144

batman730 wrote:
Ct. Rockula wrote:
Dude had a knife. Dont police have some hand to hand combat skills? Fuck


If the dude has a knife, it's not hand to hand is it?


Of course it is. If your skills are up to par (which as a cop i hope they are) they disarming a person with a knife shouldnt be hard at all.

Front stomp kick from a distance then a crashing technique..move to elbow or hroat strike..rear throw..armbreaker series.

Anything. Its a knife. You should know how to handle someone with a knife .

He couldve pepper spray the guy even without needing any h2h at all.

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csulli
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Did he have a knife? I can't tell.

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Testy1
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Join date: Jun 2004
Posts: 3856

Ct. Rockula wrote:
batman730 wrote:
Ct. Rockula wrote:
Dude had a knife. Dont police have some hand to hand combat skills? Fuck


If the dude has a knife, it's not hand to hand is it?


Of course it is. If your skills are up to par (which as a cop i hope they are) they disarming a person with a knife shouldnt be hard at all.

Front stomp kick from a distance then a crashing technique..move to elbow or hroat strike..rear throw..armbreaker series.

Anything. Its a knife. You should know how to handle someone with a knife .

He couldve pepper spray the guy even without needing any h2h at all.


It is not a cops responsibility to take risks like you are describing.

With that said it looked like an execution. Dude should have known that as frantic as the cop was it wasn't a good idea to be fumbling around though. You could tell the cop knew he made a serious mistake when he couldn't find a knife. It's pretty messed up that he was more concerned with covering his ass than assisting the guy he just gunned down.

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Ct. Rockula
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Join date: Oct 2008
Posts: 17144

Testy1 wrote:
Ct. Rockula wrote:
batman730 wrote:
Ct. Rockula wrote:
Dude had a knife. Dont police have some hand to hand combat skills? Fuck


If the dude has a knife, it's not hand to hand is it?


Of course it is. If your skills are up to par (which as a cop i hope they are) they disarming a person with a knife shouldnt be hard at all.

Front stomp kick from a distance then a crashing technique..move to elbow or hroat strike..rear throw..armbreaker series.

Anything. Its a knife. You should know how to handle someone with a knife .

He couldve pepper spray the guy even without needing any h2h at all.


It is not a cops responsibility to take risks like you are describing.

With that said it looked like an execution. Dude should have known that as frantic as the cop was it wasn't a good idea to be fumbling around though. You could tell the cop knew he made a serious mistake when he couldn't find a knife. It's pretty messed up that he was more concerned with covering his ass than assisting the guy he just gunned down.


Soooo

A cop can only go from "hey stop" to putting holes in people?

No in between?

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batman730
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Ct. Rockula wrote:
batman730 wrote:
Ct. Rockula wrote:
Dude had a knife. Dont police have some hand to hand combat skills? Fuck


If the dude has a knife, it's not hand to hand is it?


Of course it is. If your skills are up to par (which as a cop i hope they are) they disarming a person with a knife shouldnt be hard at all.

Front stomp kick from a distance then a crashing technique..move to elbow or hroat strike..rear throw..armbreaker series.

Anything. Its a knife. You should know how to handle someone with a knife .

He couldve pepper spray the guy even without needing any h2h at all.


If either person is using a weapon it is, by definition, no longer hand to hand.

If you look into the subject a little from a real world perspective you will find that it is far from "not hard at all" to disarm a person with a knife.

The gentleman in the photo is a police officer and, I believe, a well trained use of force instructor who went hands on with a guy with a knife while wearing body armour. Inside it's effective range, a knife is up to 3x as lethal and much more effective than a handgun.

If you ever need to "disarm" somebody with a knife who intends to do you harm, I highly recommend that you shoot them first, if at all possible.

I have no opinion regarding the specific incident in the video. I lack the necessary information to form one.

Edit: I see the photo was removed. In retrospect it was pretty graphic.

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Testy1
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Join date: Jun 2004
Posts: 3856

Ct. Rockula wrote:
Testy1 wrote:
Ct. Rockula wrote:
batman730 wrote:
Ct. Rockula wrote:
Dude had a knife. Dont police have some hand to hand combat skills? Fuck


If the dude has a knife, it's not hand to hand is it?


Of course it is. If your skills are up to par (which as a cop i hope they are) they disarming a person with a knife shouldnt be hard at all.

Front stomp kick from a distance then a crashing technique..move to elbow or hroat strike..rear throw..armbreaker series.

Anything. Its a knife. You should know how to handle someone with a knife .

He couldve pepper spray the guy even without needing any h2h at all.


It is not a cops responsibility to take risks like you are describing.

With that said it looked like an execution. Dude should have known that as frantic as the cop was it wasn't a good idea to be fumbling around though. You could tell the cop knew he made a serious mistake when he couldn't find a knife. It's pretty messed up that he was more concerned with covering his ass than assisting the guy he just gunned down.


Soooo

A cop can only go from "hey stop" to putting holes in people?

No in between?


No, I didn't sat that. The cop was trigger happy but the other guy was a dumbass for fumbling around like he was trying to get a weapon out. He is a parole but doesn't have enough street smarts to know that acting like you are pulling a weapon will get your ass shot? Sounds like he was destined for a short life.

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Airtruth
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Join date: Feb 2007
Posts: 4314

The officer is wrong morally but probably ok by what they teach the police. We don't know because we don't know if this is a result of a car chase or some other issue. Regardless, police need to be trained better and differently. I've witnessed far too many people I knew that could not handle tough situations become cops and walk around with a gun 3 months later if not sooner. It's not fair to expect that person to be able to handle tense situations

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LoRez
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Agree with batman. If a suspect is brandishing a knife, the officer is authorized to use deadly force. I believe here and there are some stipulations... a knife is considered a deadly weapon within a 20 foot range, but not outside of it.

But that being said, I believe in this case it would have been better to shoot to disable, rather than kill.

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Testy1
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LoRez wrote:
Agree with batman. If a suspect is brandishing a knife, the officer is authorized to use deadly force. I believe here and there are some stipulations... a knife is considered a deadly weapon within a 20 foot range, but not outside of it.

But that being said, I believe in this case it would have been better to shoot to disable, rather than kill.


They are not trained to shoot to disable ever. If it comes down to having to use deadly force ie a gun, they will always shoot to kill.

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LoRez
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Testy1 wrote:
LoRez wrote:
Agree with batman. If a suspect is brandishing a knife, the officer is authorized to use deadly force. I believe here and there are some stipulations... a knife is considered a deadly weapon within a 20 foot range, but not outside of it.

But that being said, I believe in this case it would have been better to shoot to disable, rather than kill.


They are not trained to shoot to disable ever. If it comes down to having to use deadly force ie a gun, they will always shoot to kill.


Yeah, I know. He acted completely according to protocol. (Well assuming there was a knife and so on and so forth.)

I think if I were in his shoes I'd have attempted to disable first, and risk getting a suspension for violating procedure. But that's me.

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batman730
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Testy1 wrote:
LoRez wrote:
Agree with batman. If a suspect is brandishing a knife, the officer is authorized to use deadly force. I believe here and there are some stipulations... a knife is considered a deadly weapon within a 20 foot range, but not outside of it.

But that being said, I believe in this case it would have been better to shoot to disable, rather than kill.


They are not trained to shoot to disable ever. If it comes down to having to use deadly force ie a gun, they will always shoot to kill.


Actually they will shoot to hit and stop, i.e. centre mass. Death is unfortunately a likely consequence of this, but not the intended effect.

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