Supplements and Nutrition
 
Should I Eat Carbs On Non Lift Days?
 

LIFTICVSMAXIMVS
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BrickHead wrote:
LIFTICVSMAXIMVS wrote:

If conventional wisdom worked (or worked easily) everyone that came to get advice from TNation would look like a bodybuilder in less than a year.


Most people, including those on T-Nation, don't look like bodybuilders because they don't have what it takes to be successful bodybuilders--plain and simple! They don't have the lifestyle, discipline, great genetics, or whatever other resources are necessary. They're not lacking some extraordinary wisdom, although in some cases they may be held back by their own stupidity and ignorance, which seems to be the ever growing cases these days.

Conventional wisdom for bodybuilding isn't the reason why some don't look likie successful bodybuilders considering nearly all successful bodybuilders do the same shit, and they especially did similar shit in the beginning.

That is, they did this in the beginning:
1) Full body workouts or half body splits using basic exercises
2) A diet of 1 to 1.5 grams of protein per pound, 20% of the diet fat, and rest carbs.

Can you please provide what esoteric method we'd all benefit or would have benefited from considering conventional wisdom is usually flawed?

I don't mean to be confrontational, but if you have such wisdom, I'd like to have some of it, and I'm sure others would to.

What does your approach look like-macronutrient breakdown and lifting regimen for beginners and intermediates? You don't haveto write a book here, but I'm sure you can give us a gist in a paragraph or two.


I can only say what works for me. That is the point I am trying to make. Everyone responds differently to certain foods - that's why I don't believe in "fitting in macros" or whatever bullshit people are saying these days. We are in a constant state of flux and we should learn to eat intuitively.

For example, carbohydrates make me fat and not muscular. On the other hand I can gain muscle and strength quite easily on a high fat, moderate protein diet. I let my hunger decide what and when I should eat.

I find the idea that we need to have a post exercise "insulin spike" to be the most specious of arguments especially since we are supposed to be insulin sensitive at this time anyway. No one needs it. Just eat real food and nature takes care of itself.

If I were to do it all over again as a young kid I would concentrate on staying lean via a low carbohydrate diet and lifting really heavy like I am now. I would never bulk again and just let muscle growth happen naturally.

If I really wanted to look like a bodybuilder I would just take steroids since it isn't going to last anyway.

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tork94
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Join date: May 2009
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I somewhat agree with LIFTICVSMAXIMVS

Eating carbs all the time made me very fat. In the last 18 months I have only had 1 MEAL each week with a high carb content and i didnt whither away. In fact i never put lean mass on as fast while also loosing fat-mass pretty rapidly at the exact same time.

As long as your training hard/smart, nutrients are good and your getting lots of veggies, proteins and good fats, carbs arnt necessary at all to building muscle

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wannabebig250
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tork94 wrote:
I somewhat agree with LIFTICVSMAXIMVS


x2

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giograves
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Join date: Aug 2012
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Really agree with LIFTIC.

I can only imagine what my body composition in my 20's would have been if I weren't yo-yo dieting on "Whole Grains" for a decade. Its got fiber, it's healthy!

*note I have a B.S in Food Science Nutrition and gobbled up all that ADA food chart shit*

I certainly don't think a 15 y/o kid needs to go Keto and I don't think that's what being suggested, but creating good habits now is the best advice. Keep processed carbs to a minimum. Enjoy them to a degree to not be a tool socially, but make your daily staples "paleo" type carbs.

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BrickHead
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giograves wrote:
Really agree with LIFTIC.

I can only imagine what my body composition in my 20's would have been if I weren't yo-yo dieting on "Whole Grains" for a decade. Its got fiber, it's healthy!

*note I have a B.S in Food Science Nutrition and gobbled up all that ADA food chart shit*

I certainly don't think a 15 y/o kid needs to go Keto and I don't think that's what being suggested, but creating good habits now is the best advice. Keep processed carbs to a minimum. Enjoy them to a degree to not be a tool socially, but make your daily staples "paleo" type carbs.



Note: I have a BS undergrad in nutrition and an MS in nutrition and exercise physiology and I'm an RD. For the umpteenth time: NONE of my espoused professors eating a ton of processed carbs or overeating in general and thank god they taught about all sorts of macronutrient combinations, including ketogenic diets. My thesis professor used to write for T-mag and our report was on fat adapted athletes versus those on high carb diets.

Who is espousing bad habits or going ketogenic or overconsuming carbs or anything? No one. Nearly every successful bodybuilder consumes whole grains. Some actually do provide health benefits. Provided one can tolerate them, there's nothing inherently "bad" about corn, rice, barley, wheat, oatmeal, and so on.

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paulieserafini
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BrickHead wrote:
our report was on fat adapted athletes versus those on high carb diets.




Id like to hear more about this.

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giograves
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BrickHead wrote:

Nearly every successful bodybuilder consumes whole grains. Some actually do provide health benefits. Provided one can tolerate them, there's nothing inherently "bad" about corn, rice, barley, wheat, oatmeal, and so on.


Other than the fact that most successful BBer's are ALSO juiced.. lest not forget that BBers and their genetics are in a extreme minority to begin with. Fantastic these gifted (and ah hem sometimes enhanced) individuals can load up on 300-500g of mostly processed grain carbs (bread, pasta, etc) a day and build an amazing physique. This is NOT the norm. (Hence we have a market for Indigo)

Just about 1 in 4 people are obese and I wouldn't be surprised if 3 in 4 are out of shape and flabby as hell. And on the extreme other end, living in NYC we should know a good portion of the non fat folks are "starvationist" I eat kale and carrots for lunch right before hot tub yoga...

Point is getting nutrition advice from "gifted" folks can be detrimental to the wrong body type.

And by the way, I never vilified things like corn off the cobb or steel cut oats. But before the new "my plate" replaced the old pyramid, do you remember how ridiculous the bottom was? Full of crackers, extruded cereals, breads and pastas. lol. Basically my 20's get fat diet.

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rds63799
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paulieserafini wrote:
BrickHead wrote:
our report was on fat adapted athletes versus those on high carb diets.




Id like to hear more about this.


me too

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BrickHead
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RDS and Paul: I can email you the report if you PM me email addresses.

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BrickHead
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giograves wrote:
BrickHead wrote:

Nearly every successful bodybuilder consumes whole grains. Some actually do provide health benefits. Provided one can tolerate them, there's nothing inherently "bad" about corn, rice, barley, wheat, oatmeal, and so on.


Other than the fact that most successful BBer's are ALSO juiced.. lest not forget that BBers and their genetics are in a extreme minority to begin with. Fantastic these gifted (and ah hem sometimes enhanced) individuals can load up on 300-500g of mostly processed grain carbs (bread, pasta, etc) a day and build an amazing physique. This is NOT the norm. (Hence we have a market for Indigo)

Just about 1 in 4 people are obese and I wouldn't be surprised if 3 in 4 are out of shape and flabby as hell. And on the extreme other end, living in NYC we should know a good portion of the non fat folks are "starvationist" I eat kale and carrots for lunch right before hot tub yoga...

Point is getting nutrition advice from "gifted" folks can be detrimental to the wrong body type.

And by the way, I never vilified things like corn off the cobb or steel cut oats. But before the new "my plate" replaced the old pyramid, do you remember how ridiculous the bottom was? Full of crackers, extruded cereals, breads and pastas. lol. Basically my 20's get fat diet.


Fair points.

Yes, the pyramid was pretty silly.

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rds63799
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BrickHead wrote:
RDS and Paul: I can email you the report if you PM me email addresses.


ok, will do that now

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paulieserafini
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done, let me know if you didn't get my pm

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rds63799
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paulieserafini wrote:
done, let me know if you didn't get my pm


x2

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BrickHead
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No PM's received. :(

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tolismann
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giograves wrote:
Point is getting nutrition advice from "gifted" folks can be detrimental to the wrong body type.
By "gifted" you mean people who train hard and earn their carbs ?

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rds63799
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BrickHead wrote:
No PM's received. :(


dang, do you post on PM or IM?

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BrickHead
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rds63799 wrote:
BrickHead wrote:
No PM's received. :(


dang, do you post on PM or IM?


Nah. I don't know why they didn't come through. My PM's work I believe.

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paulieserafini
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BrickHead wrote:
rds63799 wrote:
BrickHead wrote:
No PM's received. :(


dang, do you post on PM or IM?


Nah. I don't know why they didn't come through. My PM's work I believe.



I know we have had this problem before, you once told me you sent me a pm but I never got it

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giograves
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tolismann wrote:
giograves wrote:
Point is getting nutrition advice from "gifted" folks can be detrimental to the wrong body type.
By "gifted" you mean people who train hard and earn their carbs ?



Yeah sure, an endo should take his nutritional advice from a natural ecto who can eat pretty much anything he wants. Pfff...Fuc dat carb controlled bulk strategy

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paulieserafini
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giograves wrote:
tolismann wrote:
giograves wrote:
Point is getting nutrition advice from "gifted" folks can be detrimental to the wrong body type.
By "gifted" you mean people who train hard and earn their carbs ?



Yeah sure, an endo should take his nutritional advice from a natural ecto who can eat pretty much anything he wants. Pfff...Fuc dat carb controlled bulk strategy


but what about me, I'm a natural endo.............


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