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Eating a Ton of Carbs and Staying Lean
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browndisaster
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I see a lot of guys bragging about how they eat 600 carbs/day and stay lean. I want in. Is there any method to this beyond very slowly increasing carb intake? How does this work even?

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The Mighty Stu
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You'll find that this is usually competitors who are already fairly lean (or mid-prep based on my FB feed). There's such a stigma in the mainstream media that carbs make you fat, that being able to eat so many is kind of a nice rub against the people who are always screaming that you need to cut carbs to get ripped.

Hell, I enjoy force feeding myself poptarts and fat free weight watchers carrot cakes with my lunch when prepping, and watching the overweight female co-workers stare in horror as I get leaner and leaner every week (complaining how hard it is to get my daily carb #s -lol)

A few things you have to remember though:
-Being lean allows you to better handle carbs
-Understanding that you don't need 3g of protein/lb BW, gives you more calories to dedicate to carbs (this gets lost on a lot of people)
-Active people (and you're damn active on a prep) have much better ability to handle carbs
-It's not usually every day that an individual is eating 400g of carbs (important to realize!)

S

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Waittz
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browndisaster wrote:
I see a lot of guys bragging about how they eat 600 carbs/day and stay lean. I want in. Is there any method to this beyond very slowly increasing carb intake? How does this work even?


I am not that high, but on normal days(no surplus or defecit) I am around 350-400g. This is purely my opinion:

Lower fat and protein.....tada! Or take drugs to help with the partitioning of extra calories...

Seriously though,i think some people overdo the protein which leaves them less room for carbs. 1g per pound isnt that hard, for me two protein shakes and all i need is another 70-80 grams to hit my minimums.

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browndisaster
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@stu hahah good social insight there - I got interested in this after seeing Layne Norton put up pics of bikini competitors who were more than doubling my current carb intake. I'm finishing my cut and am still doing barely any cardio. My thinking is that I can slowly add in carbs and HIIT or more lifting while staying just as lean. I am not sure how slow I'll have to raise carbs. This seems like something that takes patience and adjustments depending on how I'm doing on the scale and in the mirror.

@waiitz agreed completely. I'm going to stay at 50g fat/day and raise carbs. I take in 200 g protein/day and weigh 180 so I think it's more than ample atm. If I start taking BCAAs I'll lower it to 180 probably.

Thanks for the responses so far

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chillain
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Stu covered it: being lean to begin with typically means good carbs tolerance (insulin-sensitivity) plus those who accurately track and hit macros like that are mutually-exclusive with the typical 600g intake of the average, sedentary American.

In many cases, they prob respond well to carbs too. I think it was Poliquin's test: sit down with a stack of pancakes + maple syrup for breakfast (or whenever, just with an empty stomach). If you're energized afterwards, carbs are your friend. And if that makes you sleepy, not so much.

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DoubleDuce
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I'd just note that the urge does go away. I've gone without sugar and starch for so long I don't even want them anymore.

I ate a dark chocolate Hershey kiss the other day and about spit it out it tasted so sweet. I simply cannot even make myself drink cokes or the like anymore.

In my opinion it's a good thing, fruit tastes sweeter, and I don't feel the desire to eat the crap I shouldn't be anyway.

At this point trying to eat 600 grams of carbs would be a nightmare for me.

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kgildner
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I really do think that it has a lot to do with your current activity level is and what kind of activity you're doing. When I was a teenager/young adult training 12 times per week for my sport, which required aspects of strength, endurance and explosiveness, I was easily hitting 600g of carbs per day and staying stupidly lean while slowly putting on muscle. Now, this certainly had a lot to do with my age, too, but I also notice now that when I'm more active outside the gym (usually in the summer), I'll tolerate carbs a lot better than when I'm less active (during winter).

Seems kinda obvious, but I thought I'd chime in anyways.

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browndisaster
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I think this goes along with both your posts: I think you get adapted to what you eat pretty quickly. From personal experience, I used to eat a lot of fat and would crave it and get good energy from it. I didn't care for sweets and would get stomach upset when I had any sugary food. At one point I even got a little turned on when Rachel Ray would say EVOO in her smoker's voice. That being said, I've found it easier to cut while eating some carbs and much less fat. This lean bulk will be new to me with high carbs and low fat.

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browndisaster
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kgildner wrote:
I really do think that it has a lot to do with your current activity level is and what kind of activity you're doing. When I was a teenager/young adult training 12 times per week for my sport, which required aspects of strength, endurance and explosiveness, I was easily hitting 600g of carbs per day and staying stupidly lean while slowly putting on muscle. Now, this certainly had a lot to do with my age, too, but I also notice now that when I'm more active outside the gym (usually in the summer), I'll tolerate carbs a lot better than when I'm less active (during winter).

Seems kinda obvious, but I thought I'd chime in anyways.

that brings up a good point - I need to find a somewhat enjoyable way to keep my activity levels up this Winter.

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Lonnie123
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The Mighty Stu wrote:
Hell, I enjoy force feeding myself poptarts and fat free weight watchers carrot cakes with my lunch when prepping, and watching the overweight female co-workers stare in horror as I get leaner and leaner every week (complaining how hard it is to get my daily carb #s -lol)

S


And here I was thinking you didnt have a unkind bone in your body!

Seriously though, I used to do this at Denny's on my cheat meal. The ONLY time the people at Denny's ever saw me was on my post leg day cheat meal when I was contest dieting. Like clockwork every weak I would show up and order the damndest meal on the menu and have more and more veins popping up every week...

Although I never did complain to them how hard it was to get my carbs in, thats a level of sick I just cant compete with ;-)

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Sutebun
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DoubleDuce wrote:
In my opinion it's a good thing, fruit tastes sweeter, and I don't feel the desire to eat the crap I shouldn't be anyway.


Totally get the fruit thing. I get the majority of my carbs from a large breakfast/pre-workout oatmeal bowl that also has a banana in it. Every morning when I eat it I keep asking myself when did bananas become so sweet and so fucking delicious.

But I get the opposite with cravings. If I'm not careful I can easily binge which will usually include pasta, pizza, these awesome chocolate cake slices and cheesecake slices from 7-11, and icecream. I ended up going overboard for 5 straight days last week and gained back around 1.5-2kg the majority being fat.

Browndisaster,

I think you can improve your meal choices a lot if you're really careful with the macros you're set. Obviously 100g of carb a day doesn't leave a lot of room to play with, but even at 250g-300g you can eat a lot more starches if you're creative. Never use sugar, cut out sauces and condiments when you can, if you're eating something like bread or pasta, cut the starchy portion in half and add more vegetables to trick yourself into feeling like you just ate a lot of carbs.

If you really feel the need to do a huge cheat you can also cut back calories the day before or in the morning.




And there's always the "I'm on a bulk motherfucker!" excuse.

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gtl
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I've been following Layne Norton a bit lately, and also taking advice from someone with similar views (hell, I'm pretty sure they are basing much of their stuff off of Layne, too).

From what I understand,

basically it comes down to a 'reverse dieting' approach and gradually increasing carbs while reducing fat, depending on where you are starting from.

I think Layne said something about keeping fat between 15-20% ish of total intake when pushing carbs. To stay lean, you can't have both energy substrates (carbs, fat) really high. There has to be a control, and that carbs are going to be more efficient energy sources for lifting.

I think part of the gradual increase of carbs while decreasing fat is because if you are eating higher fats now, you may not be as efficient with higher carbs right off the bat and need to adapt. You are still going to have to train with adequate volume and intensity.

What I'm finding hard is that its no longer 6 whole eggs. Its 3 whole eggs, plus egg whites, and then oats! You're no longer adding PB to shakes, or eating almonds, but eating rice cakes or low fat popcorn, etc. Basically my fats are coming from the yolk and whatever trace fat from carbs and from leaner meats.

That was kind of an unorganized ramble of thoughts, but I'm eating pasta postworkout for dinner right now.

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cstratton2
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You can get on Indigo and eat as much carbs as you desire, though they are gonna have to be good quality sources... You already look plenty lean already, unless you cut a ton to get where you are you shouldn't have too much insulin resistance from carb loading, basing the rest of your health is okay, no diabetes etc..

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ryanbCXG
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cstratton2 wrote:
You can get on Indigo and eat as much carbs as you desire, though they are gonna have to be good quality sources... You already look plenty lean already, unless you cut a ton to get where you are you shouldn't have too much insulin resistance from carb loading, basing the rest of your health is okay, no diabetes etc..


False. Eat as much as you desire for me i would be well above 600 and thst could be all rice and fruit. And what's a clean carb source fruit excluded carbs rarely have much of value. You eat fruits and veggies for the good vitamins and minerals. Carbs are carbs otherwise.

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ryanbCXG
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DoubleDuce wrote:
I'd just note that the urge does go away. I've gone without sugar and starch for so long I don't even want them anymore.

I ate a dark chocolate Hershey kiss the other day and about spit it out it tasted so sweet. I simply cannot even make myself drink cokes or the like anymore.

In my opinion it's a good thing, fruit tastes sweeter, and I don't feel the desire to eat the crap I shouldn't be anyway.

At this point trying to eat 600 grams of carbs would be a nightmare for me.


Why do carbs have to be sweet? Rice, potatoes, oatmeal quinoa All carbs all not sweet

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ryanbCXG
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Lonnie123 wrote:
The Mighty Stu wrote:
Hell, I enjoy force feeding myself poptarts and fat free weight watchers carrot cakes with my lunch when prepping, and watching the overweight female co-workers stare in horror as I get leaner and leaner every week (complaining how hard it is to get my daily carb #s -lol)

S


And here I was thinking you didnt have a unkind bone in your body!

Seriously though, I used to do this at Denny's on my cheat meal. The ONLY time the people at Denny's ever saw me was on my post leg day cheat meal when I was contest dieting. Like clockwork every weak I would show up and order the damndest meal on the menu and have more and more veins popping up every week...

Although I never did complain to them how hard it was to get my carbs in, thats a level of sick I just cant compete with ;-)


I like going through the grocery line with tubs of ice cream, cereal and cookie mix. The looks I get are priceless.

OP as others have said. Up your activity. Slowly increase carbs to allow your metabolism to rise. Keep fat low. And keep pro at about 1g/lb bw.

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TheNWhiter
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Alot of this is to do with how you're body responds to high carb, low carb and everything in between. My most successful cut (dropped 9% bodyfat in 12 weeks) was on a moderate carb diet. I can't do low carb - my body starts to shut down and I get really cranky. Too many carbs make me chubby.

Bulking I keep it 300g a day ish and down to 200-150g when cutting. I know some people will have different experiences.

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Waittz
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Why does everyone always spell my name wrong?

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browndisaster
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gtl wrote:
I've been following Layne Norton a bit lately, and also taking advice from someone with similar views (hell, I'm pretty sure they are basing much of their stuff off of Layne, too).

From what I understand,

basically it comes down to a 'reverse dieting' approach and gradually increasing carbs while reducing fat, depending on where you are starting from.

I think Layne said something about keeping fat between 15-20% ish of total intake when pushing carbs. To stay lean, you can't have both energy substrates (carbs, fat) really high. There has to be a control, and that carbs are going to be more efficient energy sources for lifting.

I think part of the gradual increase of carbs while decreasing fat is because if you are eating higher fats now, you may not be as efficient with higher carbs right off the bat and need to adapt. You are still going to have to train with adequate volume and intensity.

What I'm finding hard is that its no longer 6 whole eggs. Its 3 whole eggs, plus egg whites, and then oats! You're no longer adding PB to shakes, or eating almonds, but eating rice cakes or low fat popcorn, etc. Basically my fats are coming from the yolk and whatever trace fat from carbs and from leaner meats.

That was kind of an unorganized ramble of thoughts, but I'm eating pasta postworkout for dinner right now.

This is exactly what I wanted to talk about, thanks. It's an odd adjustment for me too. I used to douse everything in EVOO, now I'm using PAM cook eggs haha. I'm just going to slowly add more and more carbs in. Thanks

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giograves
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I used to actually carb cycle but after a while I simply noticed that kcals mattered way more than any dam macro ratio. I'd probably go out on a limb and say it may only matter in the "I need to be dumb lean" population (sub 8%)

I'm definitely more "pudgy" with higher carbs but I think most people mistake this phenom for what is really just more water retention. One control day per week (like carbs down below 200 after a daily 400) and some semblance of tightness returns next morning.

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BulletproofTiger
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To eat tons of carbs you have to do some combo of the following:

A) Be genetically gifted or take drugs/GDAs
B) Be pretty lean to start off
C) Eat the carbs in few doses (don't spike blood sugar many times in the day)
D) Move you ass (get a pedometer and or lift multiple times daily

Additionally you can try to spike Glut-4 (through exercise) right before and 90 minutes post meal,.,.,. something similar to the tabata protocol, but slightly less intensive. About 90 seconds of intense exercise (like squat jumps, lunges, etc) should do the trick.

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ryan.b_96
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cstratton2 wrote:
You can get on Indigo-3G and eat as much carbs as you desire, though they are gonna have to be good quality sources... You already look plenty lean already, unless you cut a ton to get where you are you shouldn't have too much insulin resistance from carb loading, basing the rest of your health is okay, no diabetes etc..


why would Indigo-3G allow you to eat as MANY cabs as you want?

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paulieserafini
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Small increases over a long period of time are your best bet.




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